How to fire people with grace, work through fear, and nurture innovation | Matt Mochary

Matt Mochary, CEO of Mochary Method, is a full-time executive coach who has worked with some of the biggest names in tech and finance, including investor Naval Ravikant and the CEOs of Notion, OpenAI, Coinbase, Reddit, and many others. In today’s podcast, we talk about the skill of firing people, why it’s so important, and Matt’s framework for approaching layoffs. We go deep on recognizing emotions like anger and fear, and what to pay attention to when you feel angry or fearful. He also shares how to build new products within a larger company, important tips on how to make sure everyone in the organization feels valued and heard, carving out time for your top goal, and how an energy audit can help you eliminate tasks that are draining your energy.

Find the full transcript here:

Where to find Matt Mochary:

• Twitter:
• LinkedIn:
• Website:

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter:
• Twitter:
• LinkedIn:

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• AssemblyAI:
• Vanta:


• The Great CEO Within: The Tactical Guide to Company Building:
• Mochary Method:
• Leo Polovets on Twitter:
• High Output Management:
• The Hard Thing About Hard Things: Building a Business when There Are No Easy Answers:
• Andrej Karpathy on Lex Fridman’s podcast:
• Wei Deng on LinkedIn:
• Free Solo:
• Ryan Hoover on Twitter:
• Essentialism: The Disciplined Pursuit of Less:
• Make Time: How to Focus on What Matters Every Day:
• Centered app:
• Diana Chapman at Conscious Leadership Group:
• The Mochary Method curriculum doc:

In this episode, we cover:

(04:43) Matt’s background
(07:39) Areas where even very successful founders struggle
(12:24) How to address people to minimize defensiveness
(13:24) The destructive nature of anger and how to feel your feelings so you don’t hurt others
(15:02) Which books led Matt to his coaching journey and software platform
(19:03) When and how to let an employee go
(31:47) How to make people feel heard
(38:05) How Matt’s coaching has evolved to include psychological obstacles to success
(39:41) What is “top goal,” and how can it help you make massive gains?
(41:25) Why Matt has an accountability partner for his top goal time
(43:44) How to approach mass layoffs humanely
(53:21) Matt’s thoughts on the Twitter layoffs
(54:10) How to innovate within a large company
(1:01:53) How to do an energy audit

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